Saturday, April 17, 2010

In lieu of a weekend report, several additional points:

Wow, what a week -- RL as well as all the other stuff.

Anyhoo, instead of the normal "this is this level, that is that...", a few points while I do some low-level SCH levelling in La Thiene...

First, there are other reasons I decided to make the move back to Leviathan:

1) Siren is far too static at this point. It's a great server with players who actually give a damn about playing the game. The problem is that getting into as fair a system like Lengendary (to whom I shall return once I return to Leviathan, probably just in time for their May 2 Dynamis run) is not that common.

2) The game, as I have stated here a number of times, has become unplayable on Siren -- even a Nyzul 21+ climb group I latched into took over two hours on prime-time US Friday night (about noon or so in Japan Saturday) to set up. Damn Chariots prevented a shot at 35 for my Disc, but oh well...

3) If things are going to deteriorate as badly as I've seen in this game, then the claws need to come out, and I need to take my (bad) reputation vs. a lot of the players to even the next level and force the GMs to finally make a decision whose side they are really on...

So that's the first part.

Secondly, just to note that Kimiko and I had a meaningful discussion last night, and we hashed out a few things (including, if that person from a LONG LONG time ago who challenged me to condemn Kimiko is still reading, pointing out just that). I do wish them well, but, since Kaeko left, the linkshell has kinda gone quiet.

Thirdly, and in response to Robonosto's latest bleating, I decided to go over to BluGartr and read up on a bunch of the drama around that (alleged) 3,000-character list of people paying for and using a (purportedly) non-working packet bot.

I just want to repost a bunch of the gems I've seen in this thread and my comments to them:

Thorny, responding to a spat with Draylo asking what makes him a better player than Draylo:

In no particular order
-My gear
-My knowledge of game mechanics, including intricacies many people have no idea even exist
-My job spread
-My ability to 2box efficiently with any combination of jobs
-My leadership/organizational skills
-My ability to use jobs other than BLU when they're better(always)

Well, that's nice... *sarcasm*

Problem: Not a few posts before, they listed at least three illegal Windower plugins, on top of Windower itself, so the gear was obtained dirty, the knowledge of game mechanics requires illegal conduct to actually effect, the job spread was obtained dirty, leadership/organizational sounds like more of that MDIYM skill, and I don't play BLU that much either, but know it has benefits.

Gethsemane basically debunks the "lack of necessity of cheating" argument:

"When it comes to using an advantage in the game that is illegal it only comes down to a few things really. The main issue would be morals. Do you believe in cheating and using any advantages in life to get something you want? Some would argue that is how people should live life to achieve everything they want in life and be successful and there is many cases that prove this works. There's also cases that also show that you knock down a lot of people to the ground and walk all over them while doing so. Main point in the end is what kind of person are you?

Okay well with all those issues aside, most people have done everything in the game and realize to get the very few items left that they need they will be facing an endgame shell that uses bots. Maybe not all their members do, but rest assured at least a majority may. Since Square Enix has no way to detect these bots and cannot do anything about them; wouldn't it be justified to also bot as well to have a 100% fair claim against them instead of being at a disadvantage? Another way to look at it really.

And to all the people that are LOLing over people supposedly purchasing bots with money that these people somehow have shit out of their asses for this bot; a majority of the bot users did not spend one single penny of real life cash for this venture. Most of them have sold drops to other people on their servers and then sold the gil, traded the gil for cash for the packet bot. Basically only a short time investment into the game. More a shell could dominate the more they could get all the money drops and equip their members with bots all the quicker.

You either do or your don't. You will always be at a disadvantage when it comes to endgame HNMs. Perhaps this post will be a clear message to Square Enix that they should put in items to pop all these NM/HNM etc. We shall soon see. Sorry for the wall of text, that was my take on all of this anyways."

Answer that, those who deny the social necessity to cheat to be declared a successful FFXI player. Since it's not me talking about it, I'll just leave it up there...

As I will do with Thorny's nonsensical justification, equating cheating, success, and intelligence of FFXI:

"Fair enough.

Since FFXI requires no reflexes, simply thought, we can assume that a good player is both an intelligent player and has learned many things about the game already. Keep in mind that intelligence is a measure of ability to learn and adapt, while knowledge is that which has already been learned.

Drawing from this, an intelligent player is also an intelligent person, as intelligence itself is a general quality.

An intelligent person will realize that kings are botted and most(all?) other NMs are not competed for enough to merit a bot. While they may or may not camp kings, they realize that bots will not end there as there will always be a way to simulate simple actions through programs and there will always be people aiming for an unfair advantage.

An intelligent person will either avoid kings or use a bot.

If someone does not avoid kings or use a bot, they are not intelligent.

Since they are not intelligent, they're not a good player, and as such, incompetent."

Another example:

Priran: "I've yet to see a legitimate defense for botting."

Eanae: "No one cares to have an excuse. I have claim, you don't. Reason enough."

That's basically the central point. The defense is that you cannot play the game (or, at the least, that portion of it) without one, because the game has been modified by the shitheads to require it.

Oh, and, by the way, to those who think like what Eanae says: Fuck you.

Priran was asked for a solution, and responded, to the immediate dissatisfaction of posters:

"This game is beyond saving. They should have banned the shit out of anyone botting back in the day and put the fear of fucking god in anyone who even thought about it, but instead they dragged their feet with their useless GMs and burden of proof that would frustrate the ACLU.

FF14 needs to get rid of this client-side BS."

Priran is right. The game now requires illegal third-party program content to be socially accepted within the game, at least on the American side of matters. To say otherwise is either ignorant or lying.

Fact is that the only real solution to botters is to ban them -- if the game is not able to survive without them, shut the whole damn mess down. Period.

This is one of the reasons I will tell Square-Enix to go fuck off on FFXIV. Anyone who doesn't think that game won't be reverse-engineered to irrelevance before the release date is real fucking funny. You don't think there aren't efforts _RIGHT NOW_, during the Closed Beta, to build illegal 3PP (or at least the basis of them, depending on how much of the game is truly unfinished) for XIV? You're real funny.

Tsuko from Asura: "A problem without a solution, by definition, isn't a problem- its an inevitability. If one has no opportunity to alter said inevitability, for the better or for the worse, why is one at fault for participating in it?"

At that point, all the people who DON'T bot should then be removed, because THEY are then the problem, compromising the enjoyment of those who do -- if their whole enjoyment of the game doesn't come from the botters lording over those who don't.

It's like the old saying: "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." I gave my solution: Ban all your fucking asses, shut the game down if that isn't going to work.

Rog sums it up: "No one is entitled to anything."

Hence why I would commit criminal acts to a lot of you if I had the same mentality as a lot of you.

In fact, as I have said repeatedly on this blog: You are committing criminal acts against not only the other players, but Square-Enix, by your continued illegal conduct.

Tsuko says, in response: "This isn't logical. Square Enix simply owes me the opportunity that everyone else has at the present time."

To which Yugl responds: "Why does SE owe you the same opportunity as everyone else at the present time?

- Non instanced zones
- Any HNM (Only 18 can fight at one time unless CFH)
- Missions with progress requirements
- Events with minimum LV requirements"

Why not just then, say, that third-party programs are a requirement to play FFXI and everyone who doesn't just GTFO? SE damn fucking well owes me that opportunity, and you fuckers justify taking it away.

Weeks: "As a rule, the few anti-botting people left acknowledge that Square's half-assed enforcement of their rules is as much to blame for this as the people who choose to cheat. But no, nobody is off the hook for their own actions as long as there are people in endgame or being kept out of endgame who refuse to play along."

One of the reasons that there are days I openly fantasize about taking a baseball bat to the remaining XI servers.

(Let's see if that gets me labelled a terrorist.)

Basically, because that's about the equivalent of what the botters are doing to the rest of us!

-------

One more comment:

You see, this is why Kaeko was a bit of a rarity, and why I can't call him all of the words that he might think I do. (See post on the revelation)

Most of these botters and their ilk derive their enjoyment from denying it to others and making it clear that they have no place for their $12.95 a month.

13 comments:

Volkai said...

"It's like the old saying: "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem." I gave my solution: Ban all your fucking asses, shut the game down if that isn't going to work."

The trouble with this is, that not a real solution. Not to the real problem.

The real problem, the reason why the TOS is what it is -- why third-party programs are against TOS -- is not enough people playing FFXI.

FFXI, from a business point of view, exists to get players to spend money, real money, on a game. To do this, the game must be worth playing. Because XI has a subscription-based payment plan, it must be not only worth playing, but worth playing repeatedly, and for far longer than most games are.

The key to this is that the game must be enjoyable.

When a player joins the game, they are effectively a +1 on the balance sheet. One more source of money. However, if that player causes another player to quit, that's a -1 on the sheet. This player now has a null value to the balance sheet. The money they bring in is countered by money lost. If they cause more players to quit, then they are a negative value, and they need to be removed before they cause more harm -- and cost more money -- to the flow of money.


So shutting down FFXI is not a solution. Instead, it takes the problem and essentially explodes it into the worst possible conclusion.



The ability to remove harmful players that are part of this problem from the community is why the TOS says that SE can ban any player without reason.


To preempt the need to do remove these players -- and to keep most players from becoming liabilities, SE has a list of activities that are against the TOS, as a prevention measure -- the majority of players will, in large part, respect the TOS. The keeps those players clear of account-hacking programs and other malware that might be found in some obscure (or formerly obscure) program like FFXIApp or NASA.


Windower and its apps, and Kaeko, are notable exceptions. Does using Windower break TOS? Did Kaeko, through various means in the past, break the TOS? The answer to these is undeniably yes, and yet they are not a part of the problem. Why is this? Because they are beneficial to the community.

Kaeko has been an experimenter and innovator, learning more about the game than many players thought possible and, more importantly, sharing the information he has gained with the intent of benefiting the community.

The Windower came into existence to fill an unmet desire to be able to alt-tab. It has since expanded its capabilities to answer other unmet desires of players, such as viewing the TP of other players, adding timestamps to chatlogs, and taking screenshots that include the UI, to name a few. Perhaps more important than any particular enabling aspect is that Windower has shown itself over the years to be a program that players can rely on to be free of viruses, and if you were to investigate its website, you would find that its owner also maintains a list of third-party apps that are both confirmed to be virus-free and, in so many words, won't cause other players who are not using them to quit. (You can look into it for yourself at http://forums.windower.net/topic/10064-rules-for-applications-updated-912009/ and make your own conclusions.)



I guess I've rambled on a... well, a lot, actually. The short of it is: when it comes to games, what matters is that players have fun. In line with this, it is not the letter of the law that rules supreme, but the spirit of the law.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

Volkai: So you know, I read the one you don't want me to post, and that's fine (there was no real vitriol -- he just wants to clear up his position, and, after reading this, I'm glad I read that one first).

The problem with your statement:

The real problem, the reason why the TOS is what it is -- why third-party programs are against TOS -- is not enough people playing FFXI.

... is that it's always been true, Volkai. The fact that 3PP have been against the ToS for as long as the game has been around indicates that, if you choose to believe that, that FFXI is a rank failure and, in fact, the game should not survive, at least in present form.

The thing, to me, is, if 3PP are necessary to play the game, then I want that right too -- but if the ToS is NOT going to allow me that right, then I have a problem with 3PP, because of their (long-standing) stated situation.

And if the game cannot survive the end to 3PP, then that is my solution, because the game, then, does not deserve to survive (and neither does XIV).

FFXI, from a business point of view, exists to get players to spend money, real money, on a game. To do this, the game must be worth playing.

People accuse me of a false dichotomy all the time, but this is why I do begin to make the statement that a lot of players use the old Los Guerreros "If you're not cheating, you're not trying."

If I had a dollar for every player who slapped me in the face (not saying you are) and told me the game was not worth playing without cheating, I'd have a new apartment for my roommate, rent paid for quite a long time.

The game should not need 3PP to "be worth playing" _if 3PP is not allowed_. In answer to a very early commenter's request for me to condemn Kimiko, Kimiko said that the one thing Square-Enix _has to do_ is to answer the Windower question once and for all.

But that does not change how disturbing it is to think that players have the right to abrogate the rules and the game balance, simply because the game is "not worth it" to play fairly, and not enough people would for the game to survive.

When a player joins the game, they are effectively a +1 on the balance sheet. One more source of money. However, if that player causes another player to quit, that's a -1 on the sheet. This player now has a null value to the balance sheet. The money they bring in is countered by money lost. If they cause more players to quit, then they are a negative value, and they need to be removed before they cause more harm -- and cost more money -- to the flow of money.

You do realize you are effectively advocating mob rule -- that the Terms are determined not by what is going to make the game balanced, but what makes the most players happy.

At that point, why not allow RMT? Why not allow complete cock-blocking of certain players to drive them off the server/to quit FFXI? Why not just blow up the balance completely?

To preempt the need to do remove these players -- and to keep most players from becoming liabilities, SE has a list of activities that are against the TOS, as a prevention measure -- the majority of players will, in large part, respect the TOS. The keeps those players clear of account-hacking programs and other malware that might be found in some obscure (or formerly obscure) program like FFXIApp or NASA.

I disagree entirely -- I do NOT believe the majority of players respect the ToS in any real respect, because of many of the listed activities which are necessary for those players to have the game be "worth playing" to them.

And, especially as server populations dwindle, that majority is becoming even MORE evident, and I believe they are simply biding time until they can do the same to XIV.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

Splitting the response to your first into some parts, Volkai:

Windower and its apps, and Kaeko, are notable exceptions. Does using Windower break TOS? Did Kaeko, through various means in the past, break the TOS? The answer to these is undeniably yes, and yet they are not a part of the problem. Why is this? Because they are beneficial to the community.

It could be said, however, that the elimination of all remaining players who insist on "fair play" would be beneficial to the current FFXI player community as well.

To me, I believe that violation of the Terms, if it gets you banned or you rely on those violations to be "beneficial to the community", negates said benefit. I said that back when the Salvage bans took place.

I mean, here's the thing: Again, we get back to the social nature of the MMO... What could be considered "beneficial to the community" might, in fact, be quite detrimental to the game balance to the point where players might well leave (but players which the community would declare openly expendable, such as myself).

I think you would agree that what is thought of as "beneficial to the community" is pretty much determined by same. If that's the case, I go back to RMT and the like and ask you if the ability to pay for your progress, in certain respects, with real money, would not be similarly "beneficial to the community" of a game in which 2/3 - 3/4 of all the players on at any given time are on characters at level 75.

That's just one example, but it's a very big one -- it becomes central to Square-Enix' control, and even ownership, of the game. Does Square-Enix have legal control or ownership of the game? Or does the community, to it's own benefit, openly challenge it?

That's why I think it is important for Square-Enix to say no, to openly go after people, and to actually enforce their ToS. Otherwise, the community rules through mob rule, and, frankly, they're lucky they haven't already lost all material control.

Kaeko has been an experimenter and innovator, learning more about the game than many players thought possible and, more importantly, sharing the information he has gained with the intent of benefiting the community.

It's almost like Michael Vick, to me: Since he has enough socio-political cache, that he got thrown in prison doesn't matter, he should be given his job back as an NFL quarterback because his talent is "beneficial to the community".

You may think that's an extreme comment, but I do question why, if Square-Enix allows banned players to make alternate characters, Square-Enix even bothers to ban the original characters at all.

The problem is that the spirit of the law you speak of is still very clear: Those 3PP's are not available to all players, hence, they are not allowed. Unless you'd like to see FFXI go PC-only...

Volkai said...

"The thing, to me, is, if 3PP are necessary to play the game, then I want that right too -- but if the ToS is NOT going to allow me that right, then I have a problem with 3PP, because of their (long-standing) stated situation."

They aren't. I've made that point elsewhere.

The only place where one might contend they are is HNM, and I would contend that HNM isn't worth touching because of the general attitudes of the players involved.

The TOS will not give you the right to use 3rd-party tools. If it did so, the fear is it would legitimize things that would cause more players to leave than would stay. Is that a reasonable fear? I don't know. Doesn't really matter if it is or not.

However, enforcement of the TOS is usually a reactive measure, instead of a proactive one -- you could, perhaps, think of it as a book a laws for which violations are only prosecuted if a police officer has been contacted by a citizen about a crime.

Thus, if you give a fellow citizen no reason to call the police upon you, you are unlikely to be prosecuted for noncritical violations.

(A 'critical violation' being one that harms not another player SE itself in some way.)




Ugh. I'm tired. I feel like I should write a persuasive essay to you about this or something. But then I despair of convincing you to change your views, as well... I dunno.

Volkai said...

"It could be said, however, that the elimination of all remaining players who insist on "fair play" would be beneficial to the current FFXI player community as well."

Assuming by 'fair play' you mean those who oppose MPK, botting, pos-hacking, item-duplication, etc., etc., then their elimination would take out the majority of the player population, and the remainder -- largely HNM members, most likely, though that is supposition at best -- would quickly leave as well through a cascading effect. Specifically:

* Player population contracts to HNM-only. Total cross-server population estimated generously at 10,000, or 2% of current player base.

1) Population not profitable or numerous enough to justify 24 servers. Server count reduced to 3.

2) Due to only 3 servers, HNM monsters devastatingly overcamped as dozens of HNMLS are compressed into a comparatively tiny area.

3) Hundreds if not thousands of HNMLS members abandon FFXI, dissatisfied with their chances of getting various drops being reduced to minimal levels.

4) Server count drops to 2 and then 1 to account for further loss of players.

5) Almost everyone quits (See 3.)

6) FFXI no longer profitable. Servers shut down.



In short, the 'endgame' (HNM/AV/PW) players rely on us, the players who do everything else, to keep the server count high enough for them to be sufficiently spread out. A single server has only so many HNM monsters, only so many pop windows, can support only so many HNMLS.




So, no. It cannot be seen as beneficial.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

I think where we significantly differ, Volkai, is that I do believe 3PPs harm Square-Enix, partially due to the reputation of the game itself and partially due to the fact that the game itself is a multi-platform affair and such advantages cannot be offered to all players.

I think there's a large reason I do believe the ban applies to Windower as well. I could understand a little different approach if all players were on a Windower-capable platform, but they are not.

As for the effects of the people who oppose cheating leaving, I disagree with at least the idea that it would initially be found undesirable for that contracted group remaining.

As it is, I believe there will be another set of mergers real soon (and I think Siren will be in them).

I firmly believe the first set of mergers were an admission as to how much illegal conduct has propped up server and game populations to the point that 32 servers were used.

I think the main agreement one might have with you is that they would no longer have the "gimps" to kick around. Given that this probably is much of their enjoyment of the game...

The other problem I have with your argument is the number of violations required for the HNM LS people to be that spread out for it to work.

Volkai said...

OH hey, part two is short and also the part that I wrote first.

"As for the effects of the people who oppose cheating leaving, I disagree with at least the idea that it would initially be found undesirable for that contracted group remaining."

It would not initially be found undesirable save by those with the foresight to see what's coming. But it quickly would.

But it would not take all that long -- three months, tops, I'd bet -- for the server count to drop to single digits and the aforementioned series of events to occur.

It's a "you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone" sort of situation for them.

"The other problem I have with your argument is the number of violations required for the HNM LS people to be that spread out for it to work."

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this.

Volkai said...

this post is just haphazardly picking comments that (I think) I haven't already replied to, and replying to them, so it's a bit disjointed and may repeat some points. Also, it's another two-party because I apparently am wordy as hell.


"... is that it's always been true, Volkai. The fact that 3PP have been against the ToS for as long as the game has been around indicates that, if you choose to believe that, that FFXI is a rank failure and, in fact, the game should not survive, at least in present form."

SE had the foresight to pre-empt the creation of third-party tools, which is why the TOS has never changed in this aspect.

What SE seems not to have had the foresight to expect is benign third-party tools. Instead of adding an exception for the TOS, it has dealt with this issue largely by ignoring it.

And I neither need nor choose to believe FFXI is a rank failure. To me it is a clear success as indicated by its ongoing presence and ability to maintain profitability while having multiple servers. I would say any MMO that makes it past the two year mark with more than one server up and running, which is also turning a profit, is an absolute success.


"...I do question why, if Square-Enix allows banned players to make alternate characters, Square-Enix even bothers to ban the original characters at all."

Because it's bad PR to be seen as doing nothing, and bad PR is bad for business if your company is also selling games for parents to buy for their kids. Which SE does.

Also, it's not that SE particularly allows them to, but simply that on the accounts side, SE ignores the presence of people. There are accounts, there are inactive accounts, there are banned accounts. As long as the person logging in on an account is the person that made the account (or the person that made the account is their parent/guardian), it doesn't matter who made the account.

The exception to this is those accounts that fall under the jurisdiction of the Special Task Force.

"You do realize you are effectively advocating mob rule -- that the Terms are determined not by what is going to make the game balanced, but what makes the most players happy."


It's not mob rule. It's a symbiotic relationship -- we can't play FFXI without SE running it, and SE can't run FFXI without it being profitable. We pay to play FFXI. Because we pay, FFXI becomes more profitable.

"At that point, why not allow RMT? Why not allow complete cock-blocking of certain players to drive them off the server/to quit FFXI? Why not just blow up the balance completely?"

RMT drive away more players than they bring in, net result is profit loss. Driving players off means player loss means profit loss. Balance loss means the game might become more fun for a little while, but in the long run it loses most challenge or becomes Nintendo hard, end result being many players quit, profit loss.

You want more players who will keep playing for a long time. None of these situations enable that.

You could try to make a case for allowing RMT. THey do make a lot of accounts, after all. However, they also damage the ingame economy and monopolize popular locations, thus directly driving away many players, and once they find the game is no longer profitable to them (everyone having either been driven off or having bought everything they can) they will also abandon the game. So while it generates additional short-term profits the final result is still red ink on the balance sheet.

calintzpso said...

Midgard merged into Quetzalcoatl recently. It killed many endgame shells, I've seen about 12 turn into key event areas(sky only, sea only) only now, or merge with other shells or just turned plain social due to the influx of presence in not just Kings Tier, but Endgame Content like Gods.

There most likely won't be mergers for a while. SE needs to re-evaluate the sudden return of members they are getting now after the Feb 28th announcements.

Technically SE was right to merge servers at first, the lack of content drove most of them away. If not a handful few to the bans and practices by SE. However they have to be reconsidering the merges now cause with the vanafest details released, they've seen an influx of users return based on the account restore service getting updates.

The Character reactivation service now has a statement that there is basically a long ass waiting list for users who wish to return to the game but their character was on a world that got merged into another. I've got two friends(my wondertwin friends) over aim telling me that are both going through PTSD like symptoms cause they want to get back in the game so bad. They quit back right before ToAH came out too. So I plan to help them get caught up and plan to have fun doing it. I was out the door too on quitting until I saw the new content and level cap, now with friends coming back, its like FFXI just got another Trilogy movie like deal.

I've got plenty of age old contacts from years past logging on from 2+ years since their last log on to tell me they are coming back to the game. I've asked them why, they told me cause of the Shitstorm of new content, level cap going up to 99, a meteor spell possible for blm, and a few who moved to Warhammer and Aion but later got just plain shitty for them when they hit the 30s-50s level range. So now they are coming back.

Future Server merges, probably not for a year plus, or at least until FF14 goes public.

Calintz said...

This is part 2 on my Google account, as the 4k characters per post and restricting multiple comment posts without approval limited me last time from adding this.

I've wanted to say/inform you of for a long time. This goes beyond petty retarded gaming gripes.

Like mentioned a shit load of times before to you, SE looks at FFXI as a Farm. We are the Sheep. Your a Sheep like the rest of us. How the cycle works. SE just wants money, because they sold their honor, their morals for it. Like most, if not all corporations. Does Toyota's Accelerator pad ring a bell?

Wanna do something about it? Move up in the world and make a productive change, stop being the retarded hippy tree hugging Black Sheep in the stock. Nobody cares for the messed up psychopath you are acting like. "Waaa Daddy never said he loved me" syndrome shits gotta stop. Most if not all look at your rantings as an addicting fuel to let some steam off. But its counter productive to EVERYONE, your like a fucking gaping black hole of suck-us-down-to-hell and its fucking annoying for me to hear about how you go about projecting it.

Wasting the potential unrefined talent.

Your Blog doesn't make you or anyone else, including me a writer btw. I don't give a shit how many hits a site gets, fuck Google-analytics.

Your like the fucking Nancy Grace of FFXI. How furious that woman makes half the world is both amazing and distasteful as it drags the worst out of people. I could go on about details retaining to that woman's faults for being put in news casting, in short term, shes an repetitive instigator of bullshit that freezes all productivity of society and news.

Argh. Quick Rant.

It's like a buildings burning down and she would argue reasons not to run out of the burning building until its beat into your head.

That's you right now! Change it!

---

I will applaud you however on one aspect I respect and everyone should respect. You fight for your views, yourself, impressively. As any person should.

HOWEVER, this is a game, use that fight for something good and stop being counter productive by threatening what you'd do to people and jail this and that shit. It's gotta stop, otherwise your just beating your head against a wall.

In no way major, productive way, does arguing for FFXI make you productive towards society or humanitarian rights/morals and ethics, Life itself. One of the things you would learn if you paid attention in school, in life.

People lie. It's human nature, subconscious survival of the fittest, fittest doesn't always have to mean physically.

As such, the human nature that is lies expands so far to include morals, ethics, each bend towards that. What we lie about and how we lie determines the detrimental degradation of those. And based on the monkey see, monkey do that America has raised its kids on for the last 100 years, lazy, cheating and not getting caught is the norm. Cause that's what the higher ups forced upon people.

That is what you should focus that power on changing. Your just a pebble in a pond now. Become a boulder thrown into a pond.

----

Good examples of putting your assets and faults towards productive goals...

Watch a episode of House M.D. Be productive with your criticism like that main character is portrayed.

Don't waste it on one company, one game.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

Volkai:

I don't give these people much credit into having foresight about much of anything. It would require them thinking more than of today and of themselves.

I believe the game has been irreparably damaged by the massive amount of corruption the players have fed into it. I don't think these players think any more than of themselves and what they can get RIGHT NOW.

As for the server count, I do openly wonder if we are looking at halving the number of servers further, _should Square-Enix get off it's ass and enforce the rules_. They already have been forced to admit that illegal conduct has propped up 8 servers.

As for your first:

I disagree that Square-Enix pre-empted creation of third-party tools, even benign ones (which may not be so benign -- again, if the information were to be so readily available, then why did Square-Enix not make all those features first-party?).

I also disagree as to the measure of simply being around to be a matter of success, especially if so doing would be simply because of rank corruption and mass misconduct. Would you consider the major banks to be as "successful"?

Because it's bad PR to be seen as doing nothing, and bad PR is bad for business if your company is also selling games for parents to buy for their kids. Which SE does.

But the problem is that, given the social climate of XI, and also the structure of present RMT, they ARE doing nothing!

Especially since much of the levelling can be done so quickly (through means outside, at least IMHO, the ToS), much of the lost work can be regained quickly, if you're cheating to begin with.

Additionally, the community actually values the community and the friendships above the legitimacy of the game itself. So the cheaters (unless undesirables in the first place) aren't discredited. (Which see Kaeko and Chinchilla.)

It's not mob rule. It's a symbiotic relationship -- we can't play FFXI without SE running it, and SE can't run FFXI without it being profitable. We pay to play FFXI. Because we pay, FFXI becomes more profitable.

You are correct on the symbiosis -- and, in fact, that's why I disagree with you with respect mob rule -- perhaps, more, "tyranny of the majority"??

Without these cheats, one could easily allege, the game becomes unprofitable. (Which see Windower.)

As for RMT, one might conclude that, in the best interests of the remaining players, that they wish to have means to illegally accelerate their characters or sell them off when they are of no more use.

Frankly, without jailing RMT, you can't remove it -- again, because of many of their tactics.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

Calintz: Re: Server merges

Midgard merged into Quetzalcoatl recently. It killed many endgame shells, I've seen about 12 turn into key event areas(sky only, sea only) only now, or merge with other shells or just turned plain social due to the influx of presence in not just Kings Tier, but Endgame Content like Gods.

Which is one of the offshoots of such a merger.

But I present Siren as a counterexample. The game is essentially dead unless the Japanese are on and the like -- and most of them, from everything I've been told, are doing Magian weapon quests. (to wit, reference that I am now on the Arcana part of the twice-attacking dagger)

The goal of the mergers was to put enough players in all times to make the game platable, and I don't see that on Siren. (One of the reasons I hope the merger on Leviathan has actually put enough meaningful Campaigners on to get Fiat Lux.)

There most likely won't be mergers for a while. SE needs to re-evaluate the sudden return of members they are getting now after the Feb 28th announcements.

I haven't seen that many on Siren, sadly. One of the reasons I'm leaving -- and so are several others I know of.

Technically SE was right to merge servers at first, the lack of content drove most of them away. If not a handful few to the bans and practices by SE. However they have to be reconsidering the merges now cause with the vanafest details released, they've seen an influx of users return based on the account restore service getting updates.

That may be the case where you're at, but not where I am. I've heard of people doing this, yes... But I have not seen it here on Siren.

The Character reactivation service now has a statement that there is basically a long ass waiting list for users who wish to return to the game but their character was on a world that got merged into another. I've got two friends(my wondertwin friends) over aim telling me that are both going through PTSD like symptoms cause they want to get back in the game so bad. They quit back right before ToAH came out too. So I plan to help them get caught up and plan to have fun doing it. I was out the door too on quitting until I saw the new content and level cap, now with friends coming back, its like FFXI just got another Trilogy movie like deal.

Blowing up the power structure was the last real card Square-Enix had. I just think they may have waited too long.

I would need to see a significant increase of the Siren population when the JPs aren't on to agree with you, specifically on Siren, for what it is worth.

Starcade, now from Siren said...

Calintz: Re: Taking the energy into more productive pursuits...

This is why I post things like some of the shit my roommate has to go through, some of the stuff I see in "real life", some of the stuff we see in the news, etc.

This isn't just how people act because they're in a game and just don't care, at least in my view.

It's that people, like those trolls in the NY Times Magazine article, have no empathy and want none to be practiced at all.

I don't see dissimilarity between the way people act on XI and the way people WANT TO ACT in real life.

It's one of the reasons I believe we are headed for a VERY hot summer, if you catch my drift.

For example, I just had my next-door neighbor (next building) BLAST his fucking horn to the complete disturbance of half the freaking neighborhood! (Not to mention the baby in the apartment below us...)

He care? No comprende...

That's why I rail here -- as well as to leave a record of what happened to this game the moment Square-Enix shuts it (and, bluntly, XIV) down.

If you're right, then I would say that Square-Enix views XI as Animal Farm ("... some are more equal than others.").

If we are nothing more than sheep, then of what purpose is maintaining the farm, short of "shearing" us... The problem with your argument is the concept of fraud.

When I pay my $12.95 a month, I believe there is a reasonable expectation that the Terms of Service will be enforced to the level that allows game balance between players and shells to be maintained.

When that doesn't happen, I bitch -- and, often, it does go beyond petty gaming gripes. It is often personal, and it is often how these people choose to act.

I wish I could be in the position where the criticism mattered.

Frankly, I wish the criticism COULD matter, because I don't know if Square-Enix is (like many other gaming companies (EA/Pogo, anyone?), engaging in massive and intentional fraud.